Dr. Misha Pangasa: I think the thing that makes me absolutely crazy is how much people don’t realize how the legislative environment of a place impacts more than just you can have an abortion or you can’t have an abortion. And the nuance to that that I’ll say is that, so in Utah, there are two clinics that provide abortion. And if people meet these exception criteria, they can have it in hospitals, which we talked about. For most people, the majority, 90 plus percent was happening in a clinic setting. So most people in Utah had an abortion there, and if they had a procedural abortion, they had very limited pain medication options. This is what’s always– I feel like people don’t realize this. There’s no law against people having pain medication, but if you have a state that has restricted any type of insurance reimbursement for abortion, if you have a state where there is one clinic in the entire state and people are already traveling and spending their money to get there, honestly just the cost factors made it cost-prohibitive to really provide any type of advanced anesthesia to these patients, or to even make moderate anesthesia more accessible. There’s just not resources to do that. And just to add more geographic complexity, when the Dobbs decision happened, in order to complete my training as a fellow, I did a one month rotation in Portland, Oregon. I remember starting doing procedures there– and it was nearly the end of my second year, I feel pretty proficient at doing procedures– but I think some of the faculty there thought I was a, I’m not going to say a curse word, but a really mean physician because I was just used to pushing people through their pain. Because you either have this procedure regardless of how painful it is in Salt Lake City, or you don’t have an abortion in Utah. Those are your options. So we were used to just, “Take a deep breath, thirty more seconds. Take a deep breath, one more minute. Just hang with me, this is going to be over really soon.” Whereas in Oregon, it was the second somebody flinched a little, “Can we give you some Versed? Can we reschedule you for the moderate sedation day? Do you want to be in the OR?” And then, in my research, I would do qualitative interviews with people who were like, “Abortions are terrible. They’re so painful. I don’t know how people went through this.” I’m like, well, but that’s not an abortion. That’s an abortion in Utah. When the whole state has basically conspired to have no resources allocated to this, you’re just limited in how you can do it, and you’re just trying to get people unpregnant and trying to do it in the most just, patient-centered way, but the reality is, if somebody really doesn’t want to be pregnant, I don’t have the option of taking you to the OR in Utah. It just wasn’t the case, and certainly, once I get my practice started here in Arizona, that’s definitely not an option. There were some rare exceptions in Utah where we were able to be like, “This patient has to be in the hospital,” but it required so many approvals, and this and that. I don’t think that that could ever happen in Phoenix. And so the pain aspect of it really gets to me, because I feel like we just get so used to saying “Well, it’s a painful procedure, you just have to get through it.” And then being in Oregon and people being like, “I want you to be comfortable.” That’s not anything but resources. That’s not anything but restrictions and reimbursement and all of those things that all come together to basically say, you prioritize this as part of healthcare or you don’t.